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Buffy The Vampire Slayer S06E15 - As You Were FULL REACTION (Patreon)

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2018-10-20 02:55:55
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Anonymous

Couldn't click fast enough and before i even watch it i can already picture your face when riley made his appearance. Oh and spikes facial expression broke my heart when buffy said she was using him but in all honesty she did the right thing. What they had wasn't healthy, she was stringing him a long and he was turning her into someone who is the complete polar opposite of who she really was and essentially bringing her into the darkness "metaphorically".

Anonymous

Shan take a break get some well deserved rest or take your dad out to go see Venom.🐺

Anonymous

I thought you couldn't stop celebrating the return of your favorite character ever ^^

seekingoutfriday

I ship Spuffy. OTP. But they've been really unhealthy since sleeping together. Spike, having a chance, felt he could only keep her if he brought her down to the darkness on his level. So he's not "beneath her" per say. Depressed Buffy welcomed that. They both need to be in a better place (end of season 5 and begin season 6 place).

Brandon Wiesner

Riley was annoying as Buffy's boyfriend, particularly in season 5 and he needed to go. I was glad when he did. I didn't mind him though in this ep, because it showed that they both moved on and could be friends even with their past. Plus, it gave their relationship something it needed, closure. It helped Buffy become stronger emotionally and realize what she wanted and needed love wise. That's why she was sleeping with Spike, even though she knew it was toxic, because she never really got over her breakups. One left town because he would lose his soul, another was a one night stand, then this one was needy and insecure to the point where he...well you know but he grew a lot in that year since and Sam is pretty awesome. Although, the "what a bitch" line was golden!

Anonymous

Riley was actually cool this episode... too bad you can't give him a second chance because people can change.

Anonymous

Spike is always in need of cash. He was always getting Giles to pay him whenever they asked him for help because he needed the money for cigarettes and blood and whatever else. At the end of the day, that Spike is still there, regardless of what's happened between him and Buffy. Also, I've normally been mostly neutral toward Riley, though believe it or not I did like certain things about him. This episode though might be my favorite of his just for the simple fact that he's not a love interest for Buffy here, and to me personally, it just allows the writers to make him more likable. Obviously if you're someone who already disliked him, then one episode most likely isn't gonna be enough to sway you, but for someone like me, I've always kinda liked him here.

Jarrod Wild

I feel like I laughed for a good 5 minutes when you reacted to Riley's sudden appearance.

Anonymous

Riley comes back to break up Buffy and Spike. The shows writers really love to upset their audience. I think Spike worked with some other demons, who sold him out to Riley. Spike is - of course - evil, but we don't often see him be this entrepreneurial.

Anonymous

i felt the same way about this story, it kind of felt just added on to Spike, not at all like we have gotten to know him these last seasons. I can't say any more at this point and need to stop typing.

Hans Olav

I think the bad scheme of Spike is because of what he said a couple of episodes ago "I can get money". He wanted to provide for Buffy, thats my thought at least

Shashank

When Spike was pining [stalking] for Buffy it brought out the best in him, trying to be someone she might give her attention to. When He “had” her it brought up some of his normally demon bad parts, and he was no longer really trying to change for Buffy, but wanting her to acknowledge that she belonged in the dark with him. The two best pining Spike moments for me were both with Buffy on the stairway of her house: first in the wish when he says to Buffy “I know that I'm a monster. But you treat me like a man. And that's...” and then in Bargaining when he sees her on the stairs for the first time having come back from the dead, James Masters captures the awe in which he saw Buffy. Also the speech of I save you every night is up there. The funniest pining moment was in Triangle s5 Buffy “You want credit for not feeding on bleeding disaster victims? Spike: “Well, yeah”. Buffy: You're disgusting. Spike (to himself) What's it take? He’s been going downhill for the last few episodes particularly[like you said], but really little by little since they slept together. Spike is a great character [my second fav after Buffy], personally I’m glad they keep both sides of him going here: that pesky remnant of humanity the judge picked up on in season 2 and the fact that he is a demon with a chip holding him back. When Drusilla says in Crush “Oh, we can [love], you know. We can love quite well. If not wisely,” it really captures something about Spike. He clearly does have feelings [love may be too strong a word, but love can be selfish, obsessive and destructive so I’m good with it] for Buffy but he seems incapable of acting wisely on them or with them most of the time. This scheme for making money though completely silly and out of left field, doesn’t seem too out of line for Spike, I mean he does gamble for kittens. Even if he isn’t the “doctor” which I find hard to believe[I’m with Buffy he’s too incompetent/impulsive for long plans] , the idea of him getting mixed up in some silly/dangerous scheme to make a buck doesn’t surprise me. I love that buffy apologies to William [the human remnant of what he was] and not Spike the demon. Also loved your reaction to Riley: whyyyyyyy??? I’m with you at a gut emotional level even if it served the story here.

Anonymous

I love the last shot of this episode. Buffy walking out of the dark and into the light. It's almost like a metaphor or something.

HuntingSwan

Shan, you know I love you but you have a definite blind spot when it comes to Spike. He's a monster, a child killer. Remember when Dawn was hanging in his crypt in 'Crush' and he was telling that story of the little girl he killed? Keeping demon eggs for profit is nothing compared to that. He may have slightly more humanity than your average vamp but if you asked him, do you think he would feel remorse for killing that girl? No, he wouldn't, he can't, he doesn't have a soul. I don't judge you at all for shipping Spike, he has sexual charisma for DAYS. It's easy to forget what he really is, especially since for 2 seasons he's been forced to only kill demons and do good.

Khanach

Slightly late is good, I was fearing you went catatonic after stumbling into the R-man 😁

Claire Eyles

Okay, seriously I had the same reaction to Riley showing up when I first saw this episode, and then the way Buffy was with him initially it was like 'Oh god, no honey, you're just looking for someone else to cling to because you're depressed as fuck and can't face that fact'. But then seeing Riley with Sam, and seeing the interactions with Buffy and Riley, and Buffy and Sam, it was like 'OMG, finally, this is how Riley should have been in the show all along; as a friend of Buffy, with a girlfriend/wife who was more suited to him instead of the 'dear gods, why?!' imilquetoast trainwreck of Buffy and Riley in S4 and 5. This episode therefore both frustrates the hell out of me for showing what should have been, and makes me happy for the same reasons.

Second_Strike

The demon eggs plot is kinda dumb, but its entire purpose is to remind Buffy, (and the viewers) that Spike is still inherently soulless and evil. The conversation about The Hunchback of Notre-Dame in Season 4 is supposed to be the perfect explanation of Spike at his best. He is capable of performing good acts, but he does them all for a selfish reason (his love for Buffy.) At his worst, he is still a mass murdering, soulless monster who is only inhibited by the chip in his head, and his desire to get Buffy to love him.

Anonymous

The egg thing with Spike was so forced, seems like they only did it as a plot device to remind Buffy of what spike "is".

Anonymous

from the episode Doublemeat Palace until As You Were are the defintley the "slow four" - but it reflects how slow and down Buffy's life had become lately. The next episode defintley marks the start of one of the best stretches of episodes in the shows history. From here until the finale is quite a ride!

Anonymous

Well we don't know what Spike does when he is not with Buffy. He is evil and soulless. The minute he found out he could hit Buffy he was gonna kill someone but then the chip to kicked in. So yeah Spike has not truly changed. Not saying he can't have his moments of heroism cause he thinks he loves Buffy but as a demon without a soul he just wants Buffy and can't truly love her.

Anonymous
>>16463743

if he has not truly changed and did all the good things just because he wants Buffy, then why did he continue to help the gang after Buffy's death?

Anonymous

Shan, don't let these folks bring you down on Spuffy or Spike in general. I agree this episode was a downer and their relationship is not good at the moment. It was much better earlier in the series. But I never stopped liking Spike as a character, nor did I stop rooting for him when I watched the series originally. Follow your heart on the characters you like and don't like, and refuse to allow any of us (myself included) to dissuade you from liking who you like on the show. Just sayin'.

Anonymous

I always imagined that Spike was selling those eggs for money to give to Buffy, so she wouldn't have to work at the double meat anymore. But maybe I'm a romantic.

Anonymous

Yep, this is an annoying episode for me, Raily appear in such a good light. and nobody confronts him for leaving Buffy suddenly after a mayor fu*# up and never even communicate to know if she even die (wish she did). In this case, Dawn redeems for me, she was the only one who shows some anger towards him. In the other hand Spike appears in such a bad light being stupid cocky, stupid "Doctor", stupid answers. I know Spike is capable of having those eggs, but this is a TV show and all the situations can be coloured to look better or worse for the characters, I think they made a huge disservice to Spike for the sake of the plot, in the other episodes he looked grey but interesting, in this one he just look petty.

Anonymous

“Why were you looking at Buffy like that if you have a fucking wife??” Once a cheater, always a cheater my dude...

Anonymous

The demon eggs weren't really out of place any more than playing poker for kittens. No matter how much we liked Spike & Buffy, he's still a soulless demon so he's going to have a double-life going on.

Bisibia
>>16459627

He didn't tell Buffy about his wife, then didn't tell her NOT to kill the demon, then had to have Sam show up in order for the truth to be out, putting Buffy in an extremely awkward position... He had already completely pissed me off in the first 5 minutes. I don't blame her.

Bisibia

I've gotta agree with most people. I shipped Spuffy, and I love Spike... but it's not out-of-character for the evil monster to do evil things. When Dru came back, he was cool with her killing that couple, then feeding off their bodies. He tried to kill that one girl after he found out he could hit Buffy. He's still a monster, and he'll still take advantage of it if he can. Just because he's in love with Buffy doesn't change the fact that he has no soul.

Anonymous

Even though I ship Spuffy im glad that Buffy break up the toxic thing they had. She was the only one of them with enough self reflection to understand that this was destructive and act on it. Spike will not because as a vampire has a pain/love mix, but also because he is very codependent, a "Love Bitch" like he said it. He will take anything from Buffy (her insults, degradation and beatings) as long as she stays with him, and that is really sad. The only one who could stop this was Buffy, and this is one big step for her to walk away from her depression, like the last scene, leave the darkness to walk into the light.

Paul Gibson

I always saw it as Spike trying and failing to help. His way fo trying to make some money for Buffy. Spike was never very good at trying to be good but i think he was trying

Leenis

Spike has no soul. He is charming, but still evil. He is consumed by fulfilling his own desires. Even when he took care of Dawn after Buffy's death, it was motivated by lust and a shadow print of romanticism, since he still had, as the judge said, the stink of humanity on him. Spike was a soulless sex toy to Buffy. Good for her in ending it. Remember, the first thing Spike did when he realized he could hit Buffy, thinking he was cured, was to try and feed on some innocent girl.

Michael Roach
>>16464841

See I forgot about that little scene in Doublemeat Palace. This is honestly a great thought that I probably would've never come up with on my own. This is why I still hang out with people who love this show because different minds come up with different insights. Thanks for this.

Richard Lucas

1) As You Were is a military reference, so I knew right away we’d see Riley this episode. 2). I do get a bit uncomfortable when you hate Riley so much as I like him, but you should always totally be you. That’s why we like you. And I can’t really blame it as I have a similar hatred for a character that doesn’t really deserve it. I’m interested in seeing if that is still there. 3) Nick and Nora Fury was a combo of a pop culture reference (Nick and Nora Charles from the delightful Thin Man series of detective movies) and a comic book nerd reference (Nick Fury, as this was long before the MCU movies so he was only known to comic nerds)

Anonymous

I still say Spike is being portrayed as conflicted. He's got no soul and a demon controls - or should control - everything about him. BUT... it doesn't all the time. That's what I'm seeing and what I honestly believe the show is telling me about him. No, he's not Angel (who has a soul and is therefore a completely different being), but he does love Buffy and at various times seems genuinely concerned and hurt when wrong prevails over right. Is it all the time? No. But I do see a conflict. Again, just my two cents.

David Caine

Spike loves Buffy and cares for Dawn and helps her friends because of that love, but he is still an evil soulless demon, if that makes him unique or interesting, that love may be expressed in destructive ways by lying to her and making Buffy feel ashamed. He expressed that love by helping the gang, but he doesn't mind if being with Buffy makes her feel "weak and selfish," her words, or that she is using him to numb herself to the depression she feels being back in this world. Spike was never like Angel looking for redemption and to do good in the world, for obvious reasons. This episode just told it like it is.

Anonymous
>>16475025

Frankly, I always thought he was a plot hole. :) He spits in the face of previous vampire lore in the show.

Anonymous
>>16472997

That is an interesting theory. Hmm, thanks! Because that plot line just never made any logistic sense to me!

Anonymous

And Speaking about not caring: I understand Riley not knowing that Buffy had died, the gang hid that, but to not say "I'm sorry your mom passed away?" That jerk! Amy told Buffy she was sorry for her loss and she just came back from being a rat, whereas Riley left while Buffy's mom was still sick and yet completely ignored that! Ugh Riley!

Anonymous

Spike the International Demon Weapons Dealer? Unbelievable. For so many reasons... Plus I honestly think he was holding those eggs for a friend. Maybe he thought they were for demon omelettes. Who knows?

Second_Strike
>>16464791

I think some people just get too passionate because they care about the show, so when a reactor doesn't agree with how they see things, they get upset. However I do think there is a difference between just talking about a character, and trying to convince Shan to not like a character. For example, when Shan says something seems out of character for somebody, I don't see a problem in reminding her about things maybe she had forgotten or overlooked. That's different than just straight up saying, "You shouldn't like Spike and this is why." Spike's a fan favorite because James Marsters is gorgeous, but also because he is super well-written, and part of what makes him well-written is that he isn't 100% over the top evil, but to claim he is "good" is ignoring a huge chunk of his character. I would agree that trying to dissuade somebody from liking a character they like is silly.

Anonymous

Other people have said it already but it bears repeating: Spike does not have a soul. He does love Buffy but he can only love selfishly without a soul, and that manifests itself in the toxic ways we've seen in previous episodes - the minute he gets an inkling he's "in with a chance" he does everything he can to convince her that she belongs with him in the darkness and it's not just unhealthy, it's abusive. Because she's already depressed she allows herself to fall into it for a while, and this episode is her finally recognising how unhealthy it is and taking steps to fix it. As for the egg thing - this is ABSOLUTELY something Spike would do, and your love of the ship and Spike as a character is blinding you to that. The writers bear some culpability for failing to show this aspect of his character since season 5 but it's always been who he is, and without a soul he is unable to evolve beyond it. The chip and his obsession with Buffy shackle him and make him say, do and act in every way he can to be with her. Without a soul he can "perform" good actions, but he cannot "be" good, don't let your feelings for the character blind you to that. Even when Buffy was dead and he was protecting Dawn in "Bargaining" he was revelling in the chaos and violence when the biker demons broke into the house of an innocent family and presumably tortured them and destroyed their stuff.

cil

Spike is a soulless demon. The chip only neuters him and is the only reason Buffy was ever with him. If he didn't have the chip he might've already killed her by now. People tend to forget this. There was nothing surprising about him being the doctor in this episode. Let's never forget that he beat the sh*t out of Buffy just minutes before having sex with her for the first time. I already know his defenders are going to say "well she beat him up too"...but that's exactly my point. She had to fight him off first. The only reason she finally agreed to sleep with him is because she was depressed and wanted to feel something...anything...even if it was pain (listen to the lyrics at the beginning of 'walk through the fire'). They had a volatile, abusive relationship -- whether their shippers want to admit that or not. I could also make the argument that he doesn't actually love Buffy. His feelings for her are more lust and infatuation...but I won't go down that rabbit hole because that's a whole separate conversation.

Anonymous

Here is a link to a feature called “Blackwood Meets Buffy” with Richard Blackwood interviewing SMG on the set while “As You Were” was being filmed. It was done for British television and features a little 'behind the scenes' info too. (Time 45:18) There are no spoilers in the feature but it's on Youtube so there's no telling what else might show up on the page. <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znb3l6hIbqA" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znb3l6hIbqA</a>

Anonymous

I think something the writers like to play around with is the Point of View for a story line and then leave it for the viewer to figure out. Since the end of “Smashed,” we haven't seen what Spike has been doing (besides Buffy) because we're getting their 'relationship' primarily from Buffy's POV and she has been completely oblivious to what else Spike has been doing. Likewise, if Riley and Sam seem almost Fairy Tale perfect it's because Buffy, Willow, Xander, Anya and even Dawn are each wrapped up in their own problems. To each of them the happy couple seems extraordinarily awesome. Sam's sole purpose, in fact, seems to be to tell each character exactly what they want (or need) to hear. Then she leaves. Regarding Spike and his big plan, Riley told us that the demon was coming to the Hellmouth to spawn anyway so all Spike needed to do was get the eggs, freeze the eggs, and put them on ebay. Completing 1 step of a plan out of 3 seems about right for him. I love Riley's simple message to Buffy: that her circumstances do not define who she is. Angel, Giles and Xander have all said something similar in the past but she needed to hear it again. Hopefully those words will have a bigger impact on her this time.

Anonymous

l still think it is unbelievable for Spike to be the "Doctor." Not because I think its too evil a scheme for him, but because it is an absurdly complicated scheme that would requires Spike to have good standing with the demon/human military community. Internationally. Thus far, his biggest/best friend is Clem who isn't exactly the "Big Bad." Spike is barely accepted as a poker buddy, ("Don't let him in, he kills our kind!") vampires are reviled as "blood rats" by most the of the demon community, and since getting a chip, he can't make the same contacts with humans that he might have been able to before. Also, lets think about the type of evil Spike is into. This scheme as evil as it is, is too distant for Spike to enjoy. He likes his evil to be up close and personal. It's part of the reason he goes after Slayers, for the adrenaline rush. Also "Doctor"? Does that sound like a nickname a character like "Spike" would want to be called? If anything, the name like "Doctor" is heading back towards the territory of 'nancyboy nicknames' that Spike hates so much... Honestly, I think a buddy of his offered him some cash to keep some eggs at his place, and without knowing ( or caring) what they were or what they were going to be used for, Spike accepted. (The reason I think he didn't know what the eggs were? They are clearly a safety hazard. You'd think a 100+ year old vampire would keep proper precautions over a set of dangerous demon eggs he is keeping in his house. Where he sleeps. He's evil, not suicidal, or stupid enough to risk his life. For goodness sake, he speaks Fyarl, knows enough about magic to keep a wary eye over it, if he knew the eggs were Svelte demons, he wouldn't keep them in unsafe conditions where he sleeps.)

Anonymous
>>16492274

It could have happened with Spike as a middle man. Despite Spike vowing never to scratch anything of Warren's, I could see him going in with the trio for a percentage. I could also see him ignoring everything three little boys warned him about and declaring himself the boss. I could see the same thing happen with Willy too.

Tammy L. Faulkner

This episode showed Spike the way he was when he first came into the show... Nothing butchering about it.

Anonymous

All you Bangel shippers in the comments, know what Angelus would do to Buffy? The most obscene stuff imaginable. With a smile on his face. Angelus and Angel are the same person. Despite what the show suggests. Spike has no soul, but at least he's trying.

Anonymous
>>16489578

Well, there is one little detail, Spike can kill Buffy, his chip does not work on her...

Hef

I've been looking forward to the return of Riley, especially since you hate him so much. A highly entertaining reaction. :)

Jon Dub
>>16520688

Angel and Angelus are the same person? Do you watch the show?

Scarlett Monrow
>>16520688

Angel is the human, while Angelus is the demon possessing him. Two different entities in one body, but in no way the same person, they are not even the same species.

Holi117
>>16520688

Soulless or not, Angel and Angelus are one being. With a soul, the angelus part is pushed down. I feel like Angel has to compartmentalise and has kind of made angelus this whole separate entity to cope with the things he did. Besides, Angel is not the human - Liam would be the human, and liam was a pretty shitty human to begin with lol

Holi117
>>16477979

Read this.... Honestly, it all makes so much sense and spells the whole thing out with Spike not being the doctor and not lying..... Fucking Riley ruining things every damn time... <a href="https://theohara.livejournal.com/162286.html?fbclid=IwAR2IqliTUOyF3QPEh3Iw1Rgr1hXZjuSDlt5l-AXaaATIwd3vWIpF_7SoP9s" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://theohara.livejournal.com/162286.html?fbclid=IwAR2IqliTUOyF3QPEh3Iw1Rgr1hXZjuSDlt5l-AXaaATIwd3vWIpF_7SoP9s</a>

cil
>>16489578

I was actually referring to seasons 4 and 5 when his chip did stop him from killing her

UTU49
>>16520688

This bickering is pointless. Spike and Angel were depicted completely differently right from the start. Comparing Spike and Angel is like comparing vampires from 2 completely different shows. If you guys are fighting with each other, it's because you have been victims of the inconsistent writing.

UTU49

Shan, I'm so glad that you addressed that Buffy and Spike's relationship had become toxic.

UTU49
>>16802070

"I'm sorry... William." I actually teared up at that this time... it's such a hard moment for both of them.

Andrew Pulrang

I'm not sure I'm qualified to judge Riley and Spike, since shipping really isn't my main motivation for watching Buffy. But ... Neither Buffy nor Spike are really good for Buffy, in different ways. Riley is no good in a pretty conventional way. He's nice on the surface, but very typical "nice guy" male. Everything was all about him and his insecurities. Spike on the other hand is more complicated. It's hard to deny his chemistry with Buffy. However, he IS a bad person, or has lots of layers of bad that he's only begun to shed at this stage. And as Buffy says here, her reasons for her "relationship" with him are more about her own issues than any genuine affection or love. Spike is in transition at this point. His harebrained deal with the demon eggs is a bit of his old self he hasn't totally gotten rid of. And while Spike is very perceptive in a lot of ways, he's also kind of an idiot too. He's like a career petty criminal who MAY be a good person underneath, but you never really know when the bad guy in him is going to reassert himself. And not just the cool sort of bad guy, but the actual BAD guy. That's my two cents.