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Note: this poll will run for 12 hours only, so please cast your vote asap

Hi there,

I've just finished all the animations for 0.4 and it's time to write and code the new events for Cenvir.

New events = new dialogue trees.

The thing is, Cenvir's dialogue entity is becoming pretty unmanageable due to its huge size, and now that I'll add more stages it's gonna be even worse.

I don't really know the limits of the plugin I'm using, but even if it supports millions of nodes the fact remains that every time I add new lines, the whole dialogue map becomes more and more unresponsive.

That would be a simple nuisance if it wasn't for the way I've designed his dialogue progression. It's pretty complex because in the case of Cenvir it goes like this...:

1.- It checks if an action has been done for the first time.

2.- If yes, Cenvir (impatiently) tries to advance to the next stage. That's usually not possible due to lack of Lust points, so the previous (repeatable) actions are shown.

3.- Next time, if Lust points are enough, the player *could* accept the next (first instance) action.

4.- Rinse and repeat.

Actually, it's far, FAR more complex than this. And a good chunk of my time is spent in troubleshooting the dialogue flow so it behaves as intended. So, I've been thinking for some time of an simpler alternative that leaves me more time for other aspects of development.

That would consist in presenting to you ALL actions just from the start.

If you guys have played games like 'New Paths' you'll know what I mean...

In our case for 0.4, after Meiri leaves you with Cenvir, he wouldn't start asking if you're up to try something new. When the screen fades in, you'd see a generic menu with a number of actions (handjob, footjob, titjob, blowjob, sex), enabled or disabled according to their Lust points requirements, and you would be the one choosing which one you want to initiate.

Next, the game would check if you already did that one. If you didn't, your typical 'I'm reluctant but okay' event would play out. And the next iterations will be repetitions.

The main change here is that you won't be able to see more of those 'Oh, how dare you to ask something like that from me!!??' dialogues. That means less immersion because, as you know, Cenvir always tries to escalate things with her way before she's even ready.

But... at this point I suspect you're already tired of that routine. And I'm also tired of writing that kind of dialogues from both her and Cenvir's part. They take a lot of time and add some layers of complexity that I'd be happy to avoid.

So, to summarize, if I do things like that from now on, you'll always see a successful event playing out when you select it. If it's not disabled (gray color) and you press it, there would be no turning back.

This would let me focus on mechanics, instead of so much writing, which is good in my books.

However... you people are our bosses. That's a fact. And this is important, so I won't change it unilaterally. So, asking you first is in order...:

Question: Do you accept me changing most dialogues to a 'Just do it!' style?

I do hope I've explained well what this change will mean, but if you don't understand, please ask bellow.

Comments

Anonymous

Yes no, maybe. I don't know, can you repeat the question?

Anonymous

I'm kinda ok with either. But just to be sure are you going to be making to be where Krystal is partly pressured into doing stuff? Or is like the older LOKs where if you have enough exp or lust to do certain actions.

RagDoll

If the survey is approved, will the new method of dialogue be implemented in version 0.4?

kuja

She will be still very reluctant to try a new action, so the first scene would be Cenvir trying to convince her to do it, just as now. The difference is that you won't be able to say "no". If you had enough Lust points to activate the dialogue option, then you'll do it no matter what.

Anonymous

Honestly those "How dare he" dialogues are my favorite. So I'd prefer to keep those in.

Anonymous

I love the dialogue as it is, but if it is causing you guys a ton of issues and it's frustrating to work with, I'd rather you change it to make your lives easier.

Odriew

I greatly enjoy Krystal being pressured. You mentioned in another comment that she will still be reluctant in the first one of everything, so I'll live either way.

Anonymous

If i understand the program check all the history of actions. For me its a good option. If Krystal want do it she can do it direclty. But all other dialogue doent move? All the dialog with Cenvir are good and are helpfull for the relation with Krystal.

Anonymous

This is a tough choice. When I was a new player, it’s kinda nice to be surprised with “what’s it gunna be now?” I’m voting yes so the ball can get moving (so to speak) but, if Kry is starting to get “familiar” with someone new I’d like it to be the format I’ve come to expect. So basically I’m being greedy and asking for both options :p

Anonymous

I'm fine with this personally, just as long as we can still have a sense of reluctance from Krystal in the remaining dialogue. It would be a massive turn off if we had a willing Krystal given her situation. But if you still wanted a way to cater to both parties on this issue and since the game will be much easier to make this way, you could put equal effort into the slave route now and make that the submissive, unwilling route and the non slave route be the more compliant 'willing to try things' Krystal. ///// Basically what I mean is SLAVE- "Do it!" "Ew gross!!" [Does is disgustedly with added emphasis on discomfort, smell, disgusted thoughts, etc.] NON-SLAVE- "Only if you do this for me" "(Sigh) Fine" [Does it with far less complaints, and talks more like she's trying to perform] ///// Just my idea, I know personally that alot of us like the feeling of being pressured and used and others don't so obviously people like myself are gonna chose the slave route so catering that to the masochists and submissives seems logical whereas giving the choice early on to avoid that kind of dialogue for the others would probably be much appreciated.

Anonymous

Its a shame this structure is messing you up so badly, I really enjoy the current layout and the narrative it relays. Is there no way the tangle you have currently can be broken into smaller seperate pieces or restructured to make this easier? I'm having difficulty seeing how you have run into this issue.

kuja

I'll try to clarify how this will actually go tomorrow. My explanation has been a little poor, I think...

Anonymous

From my understanding, it would play out something like this. You meet with him, he says his initial dialogue, and then you get a choice wheel, probably similar to the one already in place when you are unable to do his next option. (Example, sharing the favor, at least right now). So, if able to take that option, their usual "So, Krystal, how about trying this? "What- How could you... Sigh.. Fine" sort of thing would happen the first time. At least from the sound of it. It sounds like an experiment, and if it makes it easier for you, why not right? I think I can get behind that.

Haiko FrostyPaws

I love full dialogue, it brings more story and more importantly better stimulation and helps the player get more interaction in the game. Personally love it because it makes the game much more safisticated and better than all the others.

Anonymous

i like the conversations that lead up to the actions. it gives a sense of immersion and character building. i like the way the first guard makes it seem like the tribe works like some sort of ritualistic clan and then the MC carries that idea to Cenvir.

Anonymous

This has the possibility to make the game so much worse.

Leche con chocolate

I'm fine with this for the sake of speeding up releases and content however I have only seen the original style that you used once and that's here. It feels really smooth, new and original. With that said I hope that later on you can reapply it (maybe after finding a smoother way to implement it) but for now I'm way fine with this considering the pros to the cons. Also is there a chance that you could redo this poll after a release with the new dialog system when we have a clearer picture on how it works?

Leche con chocolate

Also can you use a specific tag for the download posts like "game" so it's easier to find. I may just be dumb but I have trouble finding it often.

Anonymous

So does that mean that you'd be able to skip to the "last scene"? Because I don't really like that. Also, I like the way Krystal is reluctant at first and slowly eases into things. I'm not really sure I'd like a "willing to try anything" Krystal

Anonymous

i got an email about the update after the poll ended ._.

Roman

So when is the 0.4 release?

Anonymous

I don't like the idea of seeing every possible outcome from the start, that takes away the excitement of finding out how far Krystal will go. Though I agree with removing the dialogue you mentioned. I don't know anything about Unity programming but I feel something like this shouldn't make it unresponsive (or are you talking about the editor?). If the Cenvir events are all in one dialogue tree and it's getting too big, isn't there a way to divide it and switch between different trees? For example one for each act which only needs a variable for if it's the first time or a repeat.

Mr Stealth

It sounds like a good idea using the lust points as a filter like system.

Anonymous

I don't agree with my fellow patrons this time. Our main character loses personality without those dialogues. But tyranny of democracy, I guess.

RagDoll

we will have to wait to see how this new system works but I do not like it very much either.

Anonymous

I don't going to lie, i like those dialogues they gives their thing to the main character, but if they are getting in the way of the development of the game i think the best option is to remove them

Anonymous

when you start creating a game and go to creators’ thread to get some advices from others, many non-professional game creators say 'keep the system simple and complete it first(especially for your first production). if you try to put all your ideas in it, you lose your enthusiasm before you finish. don't worry. you can add details afterward.' beginners can't estimate exactly how much work they need to implement each system before they actually make it. so the total amount to reach a certain ‘ending’ can hardly imaginable. this is why the ‘first goal’ should be as near as possible, then extend it when you still have extra energy for it. i think everyone knows many prospective great games have been abandoned on their way before they are actually finished. i don’t want LOK will be another example of it. sorry for long comment.

Anonymous

It depends. I dislike the idea of removing dialogue that actually is a huge part of character development of each character for sake of going straight to sexual scene. Instead of writting "how dare you asking about me such things" every time something new is introduced you should make those character getting used to the idea of being more advanterous with each scene. Krystal should start from "how dare you asking about me such things" mentality to "let's try it out/let's do this" across all sexual encounters with Cenvir or other characters. You did something like that partialy with Krystal daydreaming about taking a step further during sexual encounters with Cenvir. Past Cenvir deep blowjob scene she shouldn't have "how dare you asking about me such thing" mentality anymore for the rest of the game when she is going to have sex with Cenvir or any other character to be honest. She would have been too lustful to say no to the offer.

Anonymous

I'm afraid if the removal of such dialogues stepped too far, LOK would become a game with mindless sex scenes.

Anonymous

Why don't you intruduce three stages per option. Let's say you are providing each option in a dialogue box and the first time you have unlocked an option its like, hey i don't want to do that, how dare you are even suggesting it. The shot down selection is then substituted with a fall back to the last possible option after shooting down the suggestion of Cenvir. After this you get the first time scene, an then the repeated one. Maybe you can even give the player the possibility to select each scene with a subdialogue after the initial selection of the scene.

Anonymous

I tried to vote yes (couldn't actually vote) because I believe the most important is that you're comfy with your work. With that said I'd like to point that the reluctance and the way it progresses gives a very special sense of immersion and also makes it super sexy, like really really sexy. I think you should follow whichever path allows you to keep doing those wonderful and talented dialogues.

TerminuS

I think while the dialogue is definitely a thing that should remain a part of LoK because it is part of the immersion, I feel like there should be a way to make continued playthroughs (which will happen with branching paths) not take that long. Therefore you should do anything in your power to make the transitions between scenes and missions and stuff to do as well as between days as smooth and fast as possible so the player doesnt "waste time" doing busywork. If you have done a mission once making it shorter. A good example is how you made the pot sequence less long after the first time, or the fast travel. Also, I think making all the answer choices just show "not unlocked yet" instead of (for example) "Blowjob" might be the best idea. The choices are already there, but they can only be picked when she is ready. Try to not make the grinding TOO long though. You need to find the sweet spot between her being believable hesitant at first and the grind becoming annoying. A little cheat tool for later plathroughs or bugtesting might be a cool thing too for your Patrons.