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Tiers: Open Discussion (Patreon)

Published:
2017-04-17 18:16:08
Imported:
2020-09

Content

Maybe all of you can help me with a few issues I'm having with the tiers, as well as how to help balance them. So many assumptions I made before determining the tiers and their rewards were made before I was familiar with patreon and the mechanics of its inner workings, so please help by discussing in the comments.

The first issue is the 20$ tier. I know some people love to contribute the highest tier to support the artist, (and thank you for that!) but for many, the tier simply doesn't give enough incentive. Polling with added weight is awkward at best (I have to create two separate polls and accumulate those points back into the lower tier poll), and it leaves a strange impression for the lower tier if their poll wins one result but I declare that another option won because of weighting. Thoughts?

The second problem with the $20 tier is that I don't think the comic early access rewards is valuable enough. I can't post a whole lot about my side comic since there's so much I don't want spoiled, and with me doing comics as general patreon content, it makes it seem like the tier doesn't do anything. Is there something I can do to make the 20$ tier (and 12$ tier for that matter) more worth it without promising what I can't deliver? Please help me with this.

TLDR; I'm pretty happy with the first three tiers, but I want to make the 12$ and 20$ tiers better balanced.

Comments

GingerSnaps

I work in marketing so I may be biased. I would eliminate the $20 tier and raise the price of the $12 to $15 (meet half way at a $5 difference) making $15 the highest tier. That way those paying more will get more plus a discount which would widen your target base. Those at the $12 shouldn't mind of the $3 jump when they find out they are moving to the highest rank.

zaush
>>4742043

I'm actually not sure if I can do that with tiers, shuffling people up or down tiers, etc, or changing tier prices. Is there a way to add value to the 20$ tier and avoid making changes to tiers people have already paid for?

Graye

Another great motivating alternative I think is sketch or commission raffling. You are one of the most popular furry artists on FA and getting work from you is next to impossible. Even offering a rough sketch commission, raffling one or two off per month picked randomly from the 20 dollar tier I think would make it very valuable to some. I don't know how much one or two sketch commissions would burden you, but this worked to raise me up a tier on one of my other favorite artists (shinigamigirl), as it is basically the only way to get commission work from her right now.

GingerSnaps

Maybe offer character raffles? Maybe offer them a chance for their character to be featured/cameo in a comic or picture story? That may actually get an increase for the $20 tier if they find out about that lol.

ArcadeDragon

Do a sketch suggestion tier, maybe at $10. Anyone at 10 or above can suggest sketches and when you stream them everyone viewing (patron of otherwise) can vote on which ones they want to see. But you can have a reward specifically to the $20 tier that allows them to vote on which sketches you color that month. Can only be a few that end up colored.

ArcadeDragon

Another suggestion: make the top tier 25-30 and offer a print every month. Can be standard 8x11 print, nothing crazy. If you do that, you might want to limit the tier to a number (50, 100, whatever) so you don't have to mail 300 prints every month. Also, you might want a separate tier that costs an additional $10 for international shipping

ArcadeDragon
>>4742214

You can also tie both my suggestions together and have one of the colored sketches be the print every month, whichever you like best. Print extra to sell online or at cons with bulk rates, since you're already printing a good number on Patreon. Win-win

ArtMutt

Firstly, I'm a $12 tier and I'm very happy with what I get. For me personally, $20 a month is simply more than I'm personally able to afford, and that is the sole and only reason I don't contribute at that level. But I understand and appreciate that some folks do pay that tier, and I'm appreciative that they help an artist I love produce content that I love. Personally, as a $12, I would have zero problem with a poll being overturned because of weighted results. If anything, it would be cool if we could see the results of the higher paid tiers, just because I enjoy following the results, but I imagine that's something that the structure of patreon doesn't allow (allowing me to see polls I'm not permitted to vote in, etc.) My only suggestion I can consider is possibly every once in awhile, conduct a poll that ONLY $20 tiered folks are allowed to participate in. other than that, I'm not certain what can be added. Once again I'm at $12 and I feel like I receive great value for what I contribute. I hope financially this is working out well for you such that we get to see the great content that you generate for a long time into the future.

Anonymous

Jay gives low detail lineart in his top tier.

ArtMutt
>>4742145

As Robert Carter pointed out, Raffling is against Patreon TOS. That's not allowed on this platform I'm afraid. :/

zaush
>>4742481

I really wish patreon allowed me to show posts to specific tiers rather than all tiers below it. This would be useful for the split polls, and also for posting art 2 weeks later in HD for the lowest tier, because it starts to seem like spam getting notifications for content you've already seen. It would also be nice to be able to give certain tiers multiplied voting power in a unified poll. As for the top tier, I'm considering an idea where the 20$ slot can join a sketch stream every week or two, then throw me suggestions while i'm doodling and everyone just has fun with it.

zaush
>>4742201

I have an idea forming that's very similar to this, and it could even evolve into a similar concept. Sketches are nice, and flat filling makes them drastically better for a reasonable amount of effort.

Vandell

This depends on the workload you want to accrue. Maybe after X amount of time (specific tier) or money paid (all tiers), a person earns a little gift sketch. Something quick you can do in like, an hour or two.. maybe $60-$100 per sketch? || Alternatively, you can put your adult comics on a higher tier, separate from your finished illustrations. This may piss people off, however.

zaush
>>4743286

It's a good idea, but all my art gets posted to public places after 2 weeks apart from progress sketches that are reserved for $6 and up tiers. The patronage points is an interesting idea though! It could be an organizational challenge but it has merit.

Jake

hmm.. perhaps offer the highest tier a tutorial type deal? like how you go through your process with more detailed insight. Or maybe offer a raffle for cameos or something

passionphoenix

Why not a simple sketch commission 1 character for the 20 dollar tier? the most basic sketch?

Anonymous

The only real thing you could offer would be sketches, however that'd potentially mean more work for you for less return. Art is presumably your mainstay, and $20 a month may not be enough to cover a full sketch when you could be using that time and energy for something more profitable. The points system mentioned above is a good work around -- maybe as a quick "Thanks for your support!" gesture for those who've been giving over a prolonged period. Another alternative is to offer supporters the opportunity to have their fursonas appear as background characters in art work with more than a couple of characters, like crowd shots or the other patrons of Mystic Springs in your current comic. This takes less time and effort, as you'd already be drawing those characters as it is. It also provides a more visible incentive for taking up higher patron tiers.

zaush
>>4746063

I would probably spend a huge portion of my time doing sketches to fulfill the supporters on that tier

zaush
>>4745117

Unfortunately the raffles are against patreon TOS...

Anonymous

I really like Robert's suggestion of a sketch at $10-12 with voting on coloration, though I can't say extra voting weight at $20 would be a draw to me personally. I also really like the idea of involving some kind of semi-personalized tutorial / stream process at a high level. It may or may not be too niche, but for me that would be a HUGE draw, even if it was someone else's sketch suggestion. I'd sign up for a $20 or even $30 tier on that value alone in a heartbeat. Nothing too fancy or involved. Just a sketch and a walk-through of your thought process bringing a concept to life. And though it adds complication, I think the point system is a good idea and could definitely be used to manage the workload. You could tie points to tiers easily enough. So a $30 tier gets a personal sketch more frequently than $20 tier and so on. That way your subscribers get that extra value but you're not spending all your time doing personal sketches.

Muddypaws

I'll have to digest your comments, then look over the tier list, before I can give good feedback (though at present I have no issues with the tiers). Still..., I'll look it over and respond soon.

Anonymous

Voting: I have no issues with the weighting honestly. Coming into this blind I just sawyou finally..made a patron got gitty and contributed. Now that I have been your patron for a Bit I can have give some feedback. Personally As far as the weighted voting system I never really been a fan of it to ME it means more financially able people have more say and and those who aren't get the short end of the stick. So I never been a fan of it even if I do use it. I just don't think it's fair especially when it comes to direction on what you will work on. So for example a majority of people wanted that jungle orgy over zootopia or just as close ( I am not complaining I like zootopia honestly) But it meant that the polls where unrepresented to the majority of your patrons being weighted to the 20$ polls. The way I seen you handle it tho is awesome actually for example zootopia won but since it was close or 2nd runner up you still care about others interest by offering sketches or a stand alone image instead of a comic. Which is Alot better then what other Creators do where a poll happens and the winning poll is final say. You atleast give the other opinions/votess A nod.

Anonymous

20$ Value: How I think you can make it more valuable and desirable: Offer maybe a chance to be apart of a 20$ exclusive raffle for a comission, Raffle for maybe 20$ group for people fursona to make a cameo as background charc or a supportive charc in your art? Hold A day where you answer Q/A for 20$ group. Maybe offer raffle to send a lucky patron something of yours in the mail signed by you? You see my Point with raffles here ultimately the tiers should be about giving people the option how much they want to give to you not how much you should give them it's to support you. And patrons are happy to do so. So I say a focus on fan service and patron Apreciation through raffle system or your pick of the day. No matter what tier you choose to offer it in would help in a big way.

Anonymous

20$ Group: have a day where we can hangout with you virtually throughout your day. Have an iPad and take us everywhere you go as we talk through a Skype call. Maybe get a sky drone where the patron can control and follow you around. Picture it in your mind your eating lunch and a white drone hover just across the table from you while you order for yourself a nice meal. Best part is you don't have to pay for the patron's meal cheapest lunch ever. You still will be able to connect to your patrons in a special and appreciative "BIG Brother" way... :)

Tasuric

You may have too many tiers for what you can offer in terms of diversity in worthwhile content. I think you may have to make your peace with that as far as the $20 tier goes. Some people just want to support the artist and his work in general, which is something you may want to keep in mind when asessing the "value" of the highest tier. Perhaps trying to make it worthwhile is folly, because whatever extra work you can do for it will distract you from working on the things people are here for in the first place. Just some food for thought.

Anonymous

Im thinking loud here: maybe offer different contents to the 12 Tier such as classic art you might have already (which I think is really nice) and for the 20 tier maybe a colaboration of comics form the patrons to make their own comic through polls and comments. Plus the 20 tier patrons will get to request commissions with surcharge 2 times per month only unless they decide to increase or make more donations

Anonymous

Stationary art sent electronically so you can print It with you avatar if you open comissions.