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Kingdom Ep. 4 (Patreon)

Published:
2021-05-01 13:00:07
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Which of the three performances were your favorite? And how do you guys feel about the global fan voting aspect? I think it should be included but it influencing 40% of the votes makes no sense!

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For more Kingdom content check out the Master List here.

To check out the entire Master List from other groups go here.

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Comments

Luana Paes

Oh eu aumentei meu nível apenas para assistir a esse show, existe a possibilidade de recarregá-lo por favor?

Malaki.H

I think the 40% thing is ridiculous because unfortunately the fandom sizes aren't equal and most fans are biased which isn't fair for some groups!! As for my fav out of these 3 I think its sf9, I really liked the concept and the staging for it!! Unfortunately I heavily disliked ikons rendition of inception, like ik this round is about rebirthing the song but I felt like the way they handled it wasn't great, not only did they ruin the song for me but it made dislike the performance even though I loved the inception movie concept they were going for, like the chorus was so jarring and out of place even though its so yg it's just doesn't fit. As for the boyz I liked their rendition of o sole mio and I liked the the cage with juyeon but the stage kinda felt like it was missing something, idk like that flare they usually have, maybe it's just me. I think they downgraded their performance scale in terms of props and stage wise, which is fine but the performance didn't feel as smooth as usual (story wise I mean)

Bryn

I was just thinking about this. The results of the first stage were revealed, and I think a large part of that is…not pity voting, but voting against the top dog because “oh well they already ranked high so let someone else get some points.” I wouldn’t be surprised if we see that trend continue for the rest of the stages: the team that ranked first among expert and self eval ranks lower in fan voting, and possibly even views, though that doesn’t count for nearly as much

rockthekazb0t

I think it's TBZ is the top one for me this episode, but followed VERY closely by SF9 - they really stepped it up this time(in a way that felt way smoother). In the end, I just preferred TBZ's song arrangement more. And they fixed the issues I had with their last stage -- namely, the entire No Air performance was on one (ground) level and that made some of the choreo hard to tell what was going on and made it feel less visually dynamic. SF9 killed it tho. Much much better! I'd say they had the most clean and coherent storyline to follow, with lots of interesting visuals and details. Ikon's rendition - I respected what they did and the risk of completely changing the chorus but I wish they threw in the original chorus just ONCE for the final chorus, I felt like I kept getting blueballed lmao. And idk, I usually love Bobby feeling himself in the performances, but he kinda felt himself a little TOO much lol if you know what I mean? Like, to the point that he was off rhythm and slightly out of key.

Anonymous

I feel so bad for the boyz. They really set the standard for the competition but they always compare their performances with rtk which is unfair. Sf9 and tbz have a small fandom so they are disadvantaged when it comes to views and voting. Also I assume Ateez and Tbz didn’t have a lot of votes because there are voting strategies and these two groups are the biggest threat of the competition. This is not a performance competition but a popularity contest

Bryn
>>58899470

also, i’m suuuuuuper suspicious how self eval points are distributed. i posted something in the last video about it, but i still find if iffy

Fayyezz

I honestly feel like Kingdom has become more about the wow factor than music.. I really loved Queendom and Road to kingdom for the focus of the MUSIC. Yeah they had wow factors here and there but the main focus was the music. I feel kind of bored with kingdom at this point. Hope that I get proven wrong with the coming performences, but I really doubt it.

ab_igor

pd in case you didn’t know, the beginning of the boyz’s performance actually got cut out!! There’s a scene of juyeon and a dancer doing a tango sequence in the birdcage

Holly
>>58902114

yes!! it’s in the full version on youtube (i think it got cut out of viki only for copyright reasons) so i hope you can watch it! it was one of the highlights of their performance for me!

Annika

I became a fan of the boyz during road to kingdom and they're my #2 group right now after bts and the comment that THEIR fans would be dissappointed by their stage was so off. I haven't seen a single fan of theirs say that they were dissappointed or expected more. Most of them actually got the whole point of them wanting to show more expressions and story and not just do stunt over stunt. I feel like non fans all expected them to do a circus in this show and now that they're not doing it, they dont know what to make of it. While in my opinion the boyz are very smart for not following what everyone expected them to do and rather show their creativity with other things. Also.... eric & sunwoo both DID do stunts that were pretty dangerous (if you've seen sunwoos fancam you know what I mean) so I dont know what that "expert" was on tbh 🤐

Babkis

My favorite was iKON, I really hope YG releases the audio file for that version because I haven't stop listening to it for over a week now

Anonymous

My favourite performance of these three was SF9. It was just so entertaining with a good balance (as you say) of dancing, vocal, and performance. The Boyz performance just didnt grab my attention as much as it probably should have, and Ikon did very well but the song arrangement wasn't to my taste. As for teh whole voting thing, its ridiculous. We all know Stray Kids have teh biggest fandom and will win out on streaming and votes every time. It seems really unfair to teh other groups, especially when they may be putting in better performances.

Anonymous

ikon’s performance was my favorite from this week because out of all the performance i just really loved how much they changed the song and really made it ikon’s style. and yes i think they show only make fan voting count for 10-20% if that. the fandom size differences is huge and that is unfair

Annika

Oh also you need to watch the whole the boyz performance, they cut the beginning part out 😭

Christian Oettl

Yunho actually decided to step down himself but yes it was because of the controversy. I was kinda pessimistic of the expert scores as I feared they were hiding their way to make it more competitive. On the other side the expert comments were really on point. Loved SF9, them being the actor-idols they are they chose a great song and a fantastic story altogether. Maybe for parts like the dance break it was a little bit too dark lighting wise but besides that great. I'm confused about the Boyz. They talked with the other RTK groups about being insecure and Hwanwoong said it right, it wasn't only about the stunts but rather them having a great story on stage. For me both Shangri La and Heroine were brillant because they had a great story to the performances. And yet after all that I felt their performance again didn't have a story about it, at least IMO. Also for the trick that didn't work they would've had ways to make that easier. iKon took the song and made it their own. I still feel like they can be better but they took the expert-comments and used that really well. And yeah the voting system itself is a thing were one could probably talk long about what they should or could do to make it better. Also I really hate this ranking being always on different episodes. I get why, but it makes it really hard to keep a overview who really is in front because there will be a halftime-place and a final-place.

Kiki

Literally so off topic but I've been waiting to see whether you would see the similarities between Jinhwan and Jihoon. 100% I think that voting should have less weighting and MAYBE the experts should have more, if they actually revealed who they are. I think all the groups seem to be focusing so much on standing out by doing something wild and dangerous that they lose the essence of the group. I feel like iKON simultaneously delivered a typical ikon high energy performance whilst still doing a stage that they wouldn't usually do.

Anonymous

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzlM5Oe803o https://twitter.com/droptheroar/status/1385240926130479104?s=20 PD! watch this video, ikon really agonized over the choreo, this ikonic analyzed the dance from ikon's performance and the scissors dance + pig nose all were puns on the new chorus lyrics, also bobby's fall was the inception kick, slo-mo is the distortion of time, I'm glad you liked it!!

CRAYON weiwen
>>58899526

(the point that he was off rhythm and slightly out of key. ) I have the same thought, in the middle of his rap, I not sure he miss the beat or forgot lyrics.

Holly

I admit that i’m totally biased when I say tbz’s performance was my favorite of these three, but i think it was primarily because of the intention behind it. for me, i felt that with this performance, i could tell tbz were trying something new and having fun with it without the pressure of wanting to win. i feel like when they had the rtk reunion, they realized that they already did an amazing job on rtk- for kingdom they shouldn’t worry too much and try new things they wouldn’t be able to try for a typical comeback. though objectively i definitely agree that this was not their most impactful or dangerous performance, i do feel like they enjoyed it a lot. for instance, i remember when they did the heroine performance in rtk, jacob talked about how he cried seeing Q’s smile when he was leading the dance break because he hadn’t seen him that happy on stage in a while. in this performance you see Q break character a bit again in the dance break when New hits his high note, his smile was just so precious and he looked really at home on stage. again, i admit i’m totally biased lol but objectively tbz has one of the smallest fandoms on this show, and because of the annoyingly high importance placed on global voting i really hope they can just focus on themselves instead of the ranking, like they did for this performance!

Delphine Vdh

the one doing the high notes in the tbz stage is New!

Anonymous

Firstly thank you very much for this reaction! I have always loved all of your reactions as you always have your own point of view without being biased to any particular sides. I have watched all of kingdom and become a fan of all of them but mostly The Boyz as they had always left a strong impression in every one of their performances. I really thought that all groups did really well in this round as they all had their own unique concept, but you were right as this has become a concept war and I really felt bad for the boyz as they worked their way up to this point and people's expectation for them must be very high as well as the nature of this show is starting to change. It's a war of 'who has the biggest fandom' of course every team deserves a lot of credit but it is just frustrating to see them all trying to overpower each other. I hope the show won't focus that much on just the ratings and fame that much. Lastly I will always support your videos and can't wait for more content!

Nanathathalielie

Honestly, the 40% global voting has been annoying me since the start. It really just depends on the size of the fandoms which has nothing to do with whether the performance was actually good or not. They should've just left the fan voting to the last round or something like they did for road to kingdom.

Anonymous

The 40% voting is definitely way too much. Like let's face it, some groups have a way bigger fandom than others and will vote for their favourite group despite whether they liked their performance or not. This just throws everything way out of wack. Like in the first round for example, Ateez clearly had one of the best performances (as seen by them ranking first in both the self evaluation and expert voting) but they ranked 5th in the fan voting meaning that they definitely lost their first place ranking for the round. I think that fan voting to some extent is necessary but maybe they could cut it down to 20% so that the results of the show aren't just based on popularity.

Mesha ✌︎

I think the global voting is best when it's 15% only

Mesha ✌︎

I literally can see TBZ performance with my eyes closed, it was too good not to watch at least a few hundred times. And I definitely pick them as number one, the choreo and vocals was sick. They always try something new

Mesha ✌︎

I cried inside when sangyeon said he wants to die :( ah the amount of pressure they're in :( baby u still did amazing

Mesha ✌︎

I really liked SF9 perf too !

Catrin

I think that the way the fan voting was set up was done with good intentions. The idea of voting for 3 teams was obviously meant to counteract some fandoms being larger than others, but the execution is seriously flawed. By showing the audience the expert/self-evaluation votes before opening up fan voting, mnet is basically inviting fandoms to tactically vote and try to game the system. At the end of the day it still gives a heavy advantage to groups with a larger fan base while also disadvantaging groups that ranked highly with experts/self evaluations. 40% is also way too much and I don't like the 10% for video views either. I can't imagine that ranking changing much from week to week. On The Boyz - what I loved about them in RTK was their clear storylines (some of my favourite stages were Shangri-La and Heroine). I feel like they've somewhat lost that and focused too much on the stunts, which are impressive but not the main reason I loved watching their stages. Also I personally think they should drop the Game of Thrones concept. I don't think it really adds anything.

Anonymous

About the fan voting and percentage distribution, I am a multifan and I really like that I have a chance to vote for 3 groups however I also don't like the % distribution. I feel fan votes, experts, and self eval (group vote) should all be at 30% with streaming staying at 10%. Out of these 3 performances I personally rank them SF9 then Ikon then TBZ. SF9 is the group I knew least about going in and have grown to really love them and I enjoy the story their performances have told. I enjoyed ikons performance and reinterpretation a lot. I discovered TBZ through RTK and really started following them last year thanks to the KPDB at dive studios. However I've been slightly disappointed with their current stages. I think they killed it at the intro stage, but both round 1 and round 2 I have been left wanting more. While they have and have had cool stunts I miss their threading of storylines throughout the stages in RTK. While they have GOT as a theme I just don't feel like they are connecting it as well.

Malaki.H

Yes i think the boyz did outdo themselves, it almost feels like that critic was included to include the drama of them being pressured by their rtk performances

Mesha ✌︎

The 3 groups did sooo well this round!! idk how to rank them but here is what I think: (1 TBZ) (2 SF9) (3 IKON) O sole Mio hit my soul 🫂 there's so many things that just.... got me

Mesha ✌︎

eric is the one who did the jump in the previous perf not juyeon.

Alex P

The global voting situation was definitely unfortunate, because it's really clear that Stray Kids have the biggest fanbase, and they voted for Stray Kids, and then for the 5th and 6th places teams to ensure their group wins (not throwing shade, given the rules, it's expected). Mnet could easily fix this by only having fans vote for one group instead of three.

Irving

My favorite out of these three was definetly SF9's performance I LOVE that and I'm still not over that oerformance, I would say iKON is a close second I love the arregenment of the song, The boyz still amazing but just to rank them they will be third for me

Mesha ✌︎

PD! the beginning part of the boyz stage was cut (juyeon partner dance part) :( I think it was viki bc this happend to other reactor as well! make sure to watch the full ver on YT

Aubrey Strause

iKON was definitely my favorite!!! i felt like they really made it like one of their own songs!!!

Emi R.

My ranking changed overtime the more I saw the performances. At first I was 1. iKON 2. SF9 3. The Boyz giving the top spot to iKON because I thought how they transformed the song was amazing, that CHORUS!! But I started noticing issues I had with their performance execution on top of seeing how flawless SF9’s concept and song re-arrangement was that my ranking changed to 1. SF9 2. iKON 3. The Boyz

rockthekazb0t
>>58903779

The Boyz are unfortunately in a tight spot - if they do stunts and use props(no matter how artistically), they get accused of only doing well because of it. If they DON'T do stunts and stuff, now they're boring and "losing their touch". Damned if you do, damned if you don't. 😔

Samantha

Okay so professional theater creator here again! I have the thoughts ^_^ SF9: Personally, I think this is SF9's best performance so far. I disagree about the acting being too much but only because that is something that SF9 is known for. Also, unlike Stray Kids last round they kept is all connected and flowing as opposed to broken up by cuts and different areas of the stage. They stayed together and kept it going without too many cuts without making the audience have to jump from one to another. They showed and performed with their own color and skills, something I was missing from them last round. Also, I like the rearrangement for the Stealer a lot. I think they did a great job incorporating good level changes, group choreo, and vocal moments that they missed out on before. We can really see their growth in this new environment for them because I think we really need to remember that idol groups very rarely use props and multi level stages for their work. This is something new to SF9 and several of the other groups so I'm glad to see them progress in their own skills! Overall, 8.5/10 The Boyz: Definitely the best performance of the episode, but personally for me only by a small margin. THE ARRANGEMENT THO!!!!!! I'm in love with it!!!! The style of what they did with this performance was somehow completely new and yet so the Boyz. It reminded me a lot of what I felt when they did Danger on rtk because both of these performances focus on songs I know really well but at the same time made them purely The Boyz's performance rather than just copying/imitating the original. (Tbh, all the groups have done that so far this round but it really hit me for this stage) Overall I think they had a good balance but I still think the tango moments, while gorgeous and so well done didn't really flow into the rest of the stage as well. I'm glad they had them for the stage but idk if they were actually necessary in the end. Overall, 9/10. iKon: I'm sorry, I really really really wanted to like this stage and performance but there's also a reason why I never became a full blown iKonic; I'm not that big into the YG sound. To me, this felt too much like a mushing together of an iKon song with the og Inception. It didn't flow together the way I think it should have. However, the performance was incredible!!!! I loved how they incorporated the individual moments along with the full group choreo on the chorus. Not to mention the consistency that iKon has in being true to their own sound and vibe. I so respect and praise them for it, even if it ends up not really being my thing. And Bobby's verse just *chefs kiss* The man NEVER misses tbh, I'm so glad he's an Ateez fan now! (Mingi/Bobby collab one day hopefully?!?!?!?!) Overall, 8/10. As for the voting; it's shit. Like yes, I agree that fan votes are important but 40% is WAY too much. I think it should be 20% max if not even less. That view on my end is also influenced on how the fucking stupid ass voting is being run on whosfan with the whole you have to vote for 3 different groups. It's honestly messing it all up and is just making the outcome incorrect with how everyone is voting. It should just be a vote for your group once and that's it. Not to mention that the app is trash and constantly crashes and glitches. But as always my final say is fuck mnet and fuck the rankings, just let the lads have fun doing performances that they really can never do anywhere else and let them create as artists! Getting off my soap box now but like I think that at this point the rankings barely mean anything real outside of the expert evaluations and the views for streaming. Everything else just seems useless or pointless. Overall, I just want these artists to be given the chance to have fun and be proud of their creations rather than be upset and borderline hating themselves for small mistakes that feel like the world all because of these stupid rankings.

Giu Bressani

Out of the three, my favorite would probably be The Boyz, I felt like they really changed the song and it was a bit more simple than their previous ones, which I prefer. I really liked SF9's, but I wish they had acted a bit less and performed more. As for iKON, my opinion is a but controversial here because I really hated what they did to the song. The fact that more than half of it is completely different to the original, to the point that you can't even recognize it doesn't sit well with me. It's very easy to make a song your own when you toss 80% the original in the trash and write a complete new one. The fact that they didn't keep a single beat, melody or lyrics of the core of the original just feels really disrespectful to Ateez to me

rockthekazb0t
>>58917939

I always look forward to your take as a professional! I basically agree on all your points as well

Malaki.H

Honestly the only reason I'm watching this show is because of my interest in all these boys, because otherwise mnet is kinda doing a botched up job on kingdom especially in comparison to the previous shows, so I'm kinda frustrated and pissed off and also the voting process makes no sense to me and its not like I'm against a group doing well in ranking but some rankings didn't make sense to me on an objective level(especially in ep 5)

rockthekazb0t
>>58920820

If only Kingdom was an exhibition style show without any true ranking system, so we could just enjoy the extravagant performances without the voting BS 😩

Harley

I was conflicted because stage wise I loved the use of the movie Inception in iKon's stage but the song was not it for me. Now, I think part of it is that I'm so attached to the original Inception but also it's because I am not a fan of YG's music style. Like I could really feel the iKon/YG touch to the song which gets points but as a song probably my least favorite song done on any of the shows. Song wise my favorite was The Boyz they really enhanced the original version but for the stage I was kinda lost. Conceptually it was beautiful and matched the song really well. But for the actual "story" I was also lost. I The Boyz for Kingdom are kinda losing their story telling strength they had in RTK. I understand they are going for a Game of Thrones-like theme with the stage names but for this one I was really lost with the theme "The Red Wedding." For anyone that does know the reference I was expecting something to be of similar use from the GOT Red Wedding like in the Song of Ice and Fire they had the white walkers and the wall from The Watch but here they kinda just made the stage RED. Which I get if they didn't want to use the real Red Wedding because it's pretty graphic but even still I was lost on the story that was happening whether there was some kind of love struggle or was it a power struggle.... For SF9 I think they did really well. The stage was one of the coolest ones I've seen since it was very story driven and I could easily follow it and the remix was good. I don't really have a definitive ranking since each one had their own strengths. I do agree the voting system is so bad especially when it takes up such a large portion of the final points system and there is still the issue with the picking 3 groups so this has lead to a lot of fanwars. I'm obviously biased since Ateez is the group I stan, but seeing other groups not getting the ranking they should be getting for performances due to lack of voting it really heartbreaking.

Kayla

This is totally unrelated but does anyone else see similarities between Bobby and Mingi or think that they give off similar vibes???

Tyisha

For me I really liked iKon’s stage but I also didn’t like the way they basically changed the lyrics to the song. It’s fine to remake but that’s completely changing the song itself. The Boyz, I really liked their stage too. I definitely liked it way more than their first stage. SF9 In the beginning didn’t really draw me in because their lip sync failed. I wanted them to talk to me at that moment but they didn’t. Everything else really brought me in. The voting of course sucks because even if that team didn’t do well. Their favs will always vote for them no matter what. So it’s a huge disadvantage if you don’t have a huge fan base

Melanie Williams

Ateez dropping to 5th made me so mad. It felt like all the work they put into that stage was invalidated because they had a “bigger budget”. That being said I do wish that global votes didn’t weigh as much as it does. I’m rooting for many of the groups and it kinda feels like whoever has a bigger fandom will win. As for this episode my ranking are SF9, The Boyz, and Ikon. I really liked how SF9 took the criticism and implemented it into a better performance. For The Boyz I love the song choice. I was hoping to see SF9 perform it but this was even better. The choreography was the highlight for me. Ikon has definitely improved from the last two performances. The creativity and the stage sets were amazing and I’m really looking forward to what they bring in the future stages.

Mesha ✌︎

I hate how ppl keep comparing tbz to their rtk perfs

excellen

My problem with The Boyz' feedback from the experts is that's too vague! Just saying that it might be disappointing for fans of their performances on RTK without saying exactly WHAT is disappointing does not help them at all so no wonder they felt kind of lost. Just hope they listen to the guys from RTK to not really be so worried about the rankings and stick with their resolution of enjoying the performances and having no regrets about it. My favorite performance this week was from SF9. They really took to heart the criticism and tried to use more of their strenghts. Actually the other performances were not that far behind for me, I think all groups performed great. I also noticed the "too dark" room in the TBZ performance because of the failed torch but what really bugged me actually was after the dance scene in the cage with Juyeon I really thought the performance was over! But then it was not...so I thought that transition didn't flow that well and it was more awkward than the dark room. About the voting the problem may be the high percentage too but I feel the bigger problem is that before they at least limited x votes per fandom and asked for their top 3. So just like you pointed out even if you have a smaller korean fandom all groups would always have an equal x amount of votes by default but they would have to sway the other fandoms to vote for them in their top 3 with a good performance to win. But now just using the app for the global audience to vote without any restrictions it's just like the final live round where the voting is open to all before all the performances so basically the biggest fandom with more voting power wins. Specially because even if the top 3 rule also applies for the global voting we all know that at least some part of every fandom is strategizing the votes like mad to keep the others in check with their other 2 votes. Also from what I remember from RTK streaming did not count for the score of each round...all streaming for all performances were only counted for the final round I think. If they wanted to do it this way it should have been way less percentage for voting to at least try to be more fair cause if you count the 10% streaming that also helps the ones with more fandom 50% of the score is based on fandom size. The way it is now I feel that the expert and self evaluation scores will vary a lot but with the voting and streaming the overall final rankings will maintain the status quo till the end.

Mesha ✌︎

for the global voting I feel like other fandoms had strategy and they didn't include tbz in it? idk this is kinda sus

aicrylic (aimee)
>>58929959

I'm well aware of the SKZ strategy and we always include every group in voting, Idk about other fandoms but I would really hope that they don't exclude others 😠

Maria

the fanvoting aspect is even worse when you consider the fact that they show the self-evaluation+expert evaluation and then give everyone a WEEK to vote, and since the voting requires you to vote for 3 groups, people just end up voting for the group they stan + 2 groups that they think are less threatening because they had lower rankings (this round, it was clearly stray kids fans voting for sf9 & btob). so essentially...unless you're stray kids, who have such an overwhelming large fandom that they can outvote everyone regardless, anyone who places 1st in the self/expert evals, will inevitably end up very low in the fanvoting because the only ones voting for them are their own fandom. the whole thing is honestly so unfair, because at the end of the day, it doesn't matter how well any group did in a performance - it's just a popularity contest. one that stray kids inevitably will win, whether or not they deserve to (and i say that as a fan of skz).

Anonymous

I think my favorite performance is SF9's performance. Before watching Kingdom, SF9 is actually the group that I know least about, I haven't heard any of the group's songs. After this performance, I really liked that everyone started to work together as one (I don't mean that they do not act as one group before, but in the first performance, a lot of members got their own schedules while preparing for Kingdom, so I think they have less practicing together). In this performance, they have shown great dancing, singing, visuals, concept, as well as their acting skills. I have seen some criticism saying that they are paying too much attention to the acting part as an idol group; however, I think on the basis of their singing and dancing skills, acting skill is actually the special point for SF9, and they have fully used this as an advantage. I am starting to listen to more of their songs and getting to know more of them now, really looking forward to their next stage:)

Tesa
>>58932485

very well said! the fan voting is completely unfair and because of everything you said shouldn't be 40% of the vote :/ (also saying this as a skz fan)

Fmzzz

Honestly they are all good and their performances are great too. But music wise, i can only enjoy the boyz’s music arrangement. (I can listen without watching any performance) you know what i mean

Gracie828

Personally I think the Boyz definitely outdid themselves. Of all the groups, they continue to challenge the limits of the stage in every way. The so called criticism from the judges was dumb and in my opinion was just mnet creating drama. Of these performances, SF9 was definitely my favorite. I loved the movie feel and how they remade the song.

Sakura

The voting system is a mess. I know Mnet is trying to be transparent but they'r just making it worse. Obviously the group with the bigger fandom is the beneficiary here. Even if they make just decent performances (not saying is the case), the can win even if other groups with smaller fandom didi it better. I think is sad because all of them are there to prove themselves and what decides their "value" (=ranking) in the end is the fan voting and streaming. Also sad if any of them wins because of fandom power because it invalidates them as artists. Mnet decided to broadcast Kingdom at the same time that other channels show dramas so the viewing rate is the lowest of the triology and non-fandoms aren't voting so its totally biased. Some people say the "expert committe" is fishy because they don't know who is in it and that makes it rigged but its logical not to share their identity so they don't get hate online. At first I thought they gave a lot of power to the fan voting because they wanted to be transparent because of the past scandals but it was fan voting that was rigged so... (I am not sayin its rigged now, I just think it may be an explanation to give such a big % to it). At this point it is evident ALL fandoms make strategies to boycott the others so you only can scape from it being the biggest one. Also SHOWING THE FIRST 50% OF THE EVALUATION THE WEEK BEFORE THE VOTING IS NOT HELPING MNET YOU DUMBASS. Obviously all of them are going to avoid voting the winner. I think a well known panel of judges representing the experts committee with a higher % will help since people would trust their criteria and non-fandom voters since they're unbied (Queendom had ajumas and trainees for example).

Ryan The Biggest Dick Zandes

So, I am answering/commenting as I am reacting to your reaction to this show. I felt really good about The Boyz last performance in the 1st round. I think their concept and how they delivered it was really balanced, in terms of combating the flashy stunts. I think it comes down to the question: Should The Boyz, or any other group, do a single big stunt with little ones mixed here and there, OR do you want a well-balanced performance from the very beginning to the very end?

SanjA1800

The global voting is 40% of the final results and video views are 10%. That means 50% of the final results is dependent on the size of the fandom. I do think it's unfair. Especially when there is such a big difference between fandom sizes. Fans are not going to be unbiased while voting. I guess the 3 votes per account is meant to make things fairer but then we have multiple accounts, dedicated fans and the strategies. BUT while I agree that group popularity affects the final results drastically I don't think it's a given that certain teams are going to win. There is still that 50% from judges voting, self-evaluation plus the reward points given to the group that wins each round. I don't think any group will win solely on popularity, they have to do well in the other 50% as well. My favorite out of these 3 performances is Ikon for sure, they really left an impression. They incorporated more concept and upgraded their stage setup compared to their previous stage but it's still very much an Ikon performance (and song!). Plus they always seem to be having fun on stage, their energy is contagious.

K

agree with your comment about mnet spoiling so much like in the preview clips they released SO much main points of performances are shown and its like... alright so do i want to sit through a 2 hr long with where an hr is just dramatic music and cuts and pauses so i can see a performance they've already shown 50% of 😭 also i understand that this is a competition but rankings and the reactions of the groups after make me feel so terrible. to see them say that maybe their hard work wasn't enough even though we know they spend a ridiculous amount of hours practicing and then filming (which takes over 24hrs) breaks my heart

希文 王

Leaving a short comment bc I'm about to head out, but creativity-wise The Boys definitely outdid themselves, but I think SF9's Taeyong? said it right, that they (both teams) were busy highlighting so many members that there wasn't a clear story or point in the performance, so it ended up being all over the place even though section to section they were all very good and very innnovative

starspal

mnet is giving some sad narrative to tbz and i hate it, we don't even get to see them prepare for the actual performances nothing and it just puts more pressure on them.

Misha

I really think there is absolutely no reason that the split of points can't be an equal 25% for all 4 categories. They wanted to make the drama that is happening in these fandoms happen. I wish people could be reasonable, but Twitter exists.

Anonymous

I feel like a show like this, where the groups already have solid fanbases and they compete against one another, are always going to be biased in terms of the voting/ranking results. I mean, fans are going to vote for the performance done by their favorite group regardless of whether or not they think they deserve first place or not. Unfortunately, I don't know why global voting takes up 40% percent of the final points, but what can you do? Although I get that the global voting is, for obvious reasons, a big factor, if this show was really about "finding which group gives the best performances", I believe voting amongst themselves, and expert votings (even though who the hell are these so-called experts) are the more important evaluations.

christine cheung

When it comes to the killing part, the light source suddenly become very limited and I can barely see what they were doing, especially members wearing black clothes and when the camera is sh*t.

Anonymous
>>58912530

I totally agree! It's just a fact, I mean if we look at the views of their previous MVs as well there is a large difference. I would say every group is very talented and good in their own way but i think ppl just focus more on the popularity and the visuals more than the actual performance and the music. I guess it is very tricky as everyone could be biased.

Sakura

Funny how iKON says ATEEZ has more songs that what they expected because YG artists wait for a comeback a year in the dungeon while ATEEZ makes three comebacks every year. Also love how KQ ent gives them "vacation" after a comeback. Happy to see a company doing the bare minimum for their artists when they are physically and mentally exhausted.

Angie
>>58985102

yeah, cause ikon only have like...MAYBE 50 songs, which sounds like a lot, but considering it's been 6 years and ateez literally have around the same amount, if not more, and they just debuted two years ago -- it's kind of sad. (Yes, quality over quantity but many groups provide both. iKON were perfectly able to provide both if they were just allowed to. Imagine how many amazing songs we could've had when hanbin was in the group </3).

Kpop_Platypus

Idk if, thinking back to RTK, TBZ *outdid* themselves in the first round.  I definitely wasn't disappointed; I was amazed when I watched it initially, but seeing it again w/o all the reactions it felt kind of disjointed.  I felt like they lost their direction a bit.....which they realized and corrected for that AMAZING performance of O Sole Mio.  When Hyundai was talking about being angry & sad getting 3rd, I immediately flashed to Jay's "Resentment, Anger, Shame." 😄 Honestly, I didn't like Ikon's ver of Inception.  It's VERY Ikon (which yes, was the assignment, I know) - and w/ the exception of Killing Me, I don't vibe w/ their music.  And their idea of using the movie Inception w/ the song Inception was...less than original.  Whereas they speculated about the concept for SF9 & TBZ, the other groups were predicting it even before Ikon started.   The effects w/ the set were cool, but overall the performance didn't really do anything for me. 🤷‍♀️ As a final note: I love Han's reactions to everything. 😮😟🤩😲😳😱🤭

Ena

Hmm, for me, I would agree with the critique The Boyz got. I wasn't exactly disappointed and I did like the stage but I feel like their RTK stages attracted me more. On the topic of stunts, although I genuinely feared for the members in RTK because of all the crazy jumps and falls, it did add a cool shock factor and are most peoples favourite parts. And maybe because people have seen them do those type of acrobatics and stunts on stage before it made this stage look less exciting in a way. IDK I would compare it to when 2PM did insane flips and tricks on stage earlier on. It was very exciting watching them and people craved more performances and cooler tricks every comeback/stage. And when they stopped for obvious reasons such as health/age, the general public followed them a little less. So I guess I see why they got this critique although I still enjoyed the stage. And the second round The Boyz performance was may fav even though they didn't do any crazy stunts so perhaps it was just round ones stage that felt a little off for me.

Amanda Araujo

about the voting im not too mad about it because im happy for sf9 since i stan them but i really thought the winner for the round was ateez so it sucks they got lower because of that and also i admit that sf9's 1st round performance it wasnt a top 2 performance for me, in fact when i knew they ranked 2 i thought it was for the second round because for me their the stealer performance was 10x better and even tho im happy for them i also thought a few other groups were better in that 1st round, so with that said i like the fact that the global voting can change things up but i also think it shouldnt be able to change it too much, i think if they were worth like 30% would be nicer

Kei G

I also think the boyz expert feedback about RTK was so pointless. Like it didn't actually provide anything concrete to improve on or fix, just that it was 'less' than their RTK stuff. Also: on Changmins mic, yes it is a singer thing! Singers are trained to hold the mic parallel to the floor. I can't remember the reason, but that's a singer thing! In terms of stages: I loved SF9's rendition of the Stealer. It was sexy and dark. They had a captivating stage without excessive cuts or stunts. I didn't have any major complaints about this stage. For The Boyz, I initially loved the tango take of O Sole Mio but I felt their perf overall was really choppy and had really elaborate props but failed to use them well. I also really was not a fan of the raps in their arrangement. For Ikon, this may be a personal thing, but I do not like this 'cover'. I personally hated the new chorus, so that fell flat for me. I also was again not a fan of the added rap. I don't like the fact that it was so different; I think rather than challenging a cover, I felt like they dodged it by rearranging the song to hell. One major challenge with covers, is that whole comparison to the og singer, but like PD said this song can't be compared to Ateez's. On the other hand, I loved the choreography. My rankings as of now are 1. SF9 2. The Boyz 3. Ikon

Jade
>>58918550

they literally kept most of it except the chorus and rap break tho

Audrey

I just want to say that I didn't really want to watch Kingdom. I didn't watch either Road to Kingdom or Queendom because I wasn't very aware of any of the groups. I decided to watch Kingdom because of 2 reasons, one Stray Kids are in it and they are one of my favorite groups, two because PD is reacting to it and your my favorite reactor. So going into this I didn't have much investment. I like a couple groups but my number one group has always been BTS and I spent so much time with them because of the sheer amount of content they have out, literally years of just watching their stuff throw in some others like Red Velvet, or Stray Kids but mainly BTS. I love them! They will always be my favorite but I am so so glad that I am watching this. Every group is so amazing and I honestly can say that every time they put on an incredible performance. None of them should be ashamed of what they have done because it's amazing! Everyone has personal favorites, in the first round I loved The Boyz and Ateez, and so far in the second SF9 blew my mind with their balance between performance, and acting. Honestly before this I only ever heard of Ateez, Stray kids and Ikon. I am already spending time listening to new songs and watching music videos, and I'm so excited to have these new groups to explore! PD you've introduced me to so many new groups, so much more music and so much more of this culture. Thank you! And who knows maybe I'll go check out Road to Kingdom and Queendom after this 💜💜

Phani

This show has turned me into a fantasy. The way sf9 heard every piece of feedback and acting on them, amazing. Taeyang’s dancing also amazing 😳😌

Briana

1) While I don't think they topped themselves, I still think TBZ performance was creative and engaging. Also, I think it was wrong for the critic to speak on behalf of the fans and say that it was a disappointment performance for the fans when a lot of fans loved it. 2) I did agree with most of the critics too 3) now that you mentioned how Changmin (?) holds his mic that is all I notice 😂. You could be right or he's just nervous 4) I honestly don't understand the rankings/voting at all

Jess

I'm watching this really late, but i nerded out when the boyz sampled the erlking in part of their performance

Jess

also, I kinda disagree with you about ikon. I feel like they didn't understand the assignment at all. The song was not inception anymore, they made a completely different song with a little bit of inception mixed into it. I don't know, I feel like they kinda borderline cheated the system. I did like the performance I just don't think it was really what they were asked o do

Kimberly Su
>>60646731

well considering they were asked to do a reinterpretation of the song, and their performance actually made me want to check out the original song, I felt they succeeded. I'm not an atiny nor an ikonic and had no interest in either at all when kingdom started (i came as a longtime melody). but honestly ikon was able to peak my interest in ikon's capabilities as a group with the song along as made me want to listen to the original inception which made their performance impactful to me.

Serena Edwards

the boyz put out their kingdom dance practices and it just makes me sad to see how hard sangyeon practiced with the fire and the torch only for it to not work out, it was a really cool idea, just hard to execute i guess.

Anonymous

I know this is hella late but for me, The Boyz will never outdo their Danger and Reveal performance. However, the No Air performance wasn't disappointing at all, but I don't think they outdid themselves.

Thabit Ayob

SUPER LATE, but i reaaaaaalllly like your analysis and insight, especially concerning IKON. I love it. You are the only one of the ones i saw reacting who understood IKON take of things in Kingdom. And the ratio perf, vocal, acting, stage comments were spot on. I was frustrated how people forgot that this is for artists singers not just for a theatrical show, and people got swayed with how grandiose some perf were ignoring the essence of things that were in other perf.

Anonymous

I know I am like very late in this video but i just wanted to say in terms of ikons performance that I did not mind that they hinted at it being inception inspired bc I have never seen the movie and i dont really know what it is about so in that aspect it was good for me that they showed that because I could kind of understand that the Thing was spinning this whole time and bc of that I could conclude that it was like time related you know. Just wanted to say this so you could maybe see it from another perspective, also maybe it is bc I dont pay attention of bc I dont really know a lot about staging but in the beginning I never noticed the mistake of the fire not lighting in the performance of TBZ. Okay haha so I am watching this whole series of reactions of kingdom bc I am a pretty hardcore stay and i want to see your reaction to their stages espacially for this round bc it was pretty badly recieved but I actually really liked and I dont know if it is bc I am really biased of not so I am gonna go watch that now haha. Ps: I did not expect skz to be frist at all bc I actually liked ateez and ikons performances more and maybe also btob but I did not expect them to be last

Court V

I'm rewatching kingdom but with your reactions PD, and the way some groups were mistreated and the unfairness of the voting system is making me remember why I hated this show so much 😅 I just like watching the performances and idol interactions sadly